Over the past six months or so, I’ve been co-authoring a book about ministry with Colin Marshall. It’s been, by turns, exhilarating and infuriating, clarifying and frustrating. This is not, I should hasten to add, because Col is difficult to work with. He is in fact one of the wisest, kindest and most godly coots you could ever meet. But all big writing projects have their good days and bad days, and this one has had its share of both. Perhaps it’s because the book really goes to the heart of what Christian ministry is all about, what church life is about, and (for that matter) what Matthias Media is for and why we bother to do what we do. It’s a project that is close to the heart and close to the bone all at the same time.
The book is called The Trellis and the Vine: The ministry mind shift that changes everything, and it’s due to be published in a few months’ time. In the final chapter, we sum up the main argument of the book with ten propositions. By way of a taster, and to promote some discussion, I thought I’d run a slightly adapted version of these ten propositions up the flagpole and see what our SP readers make of them.
So here’s the first of ten propositions about Christian ministry:
1. The goal is to make disciples, not church members.
The measure of how ministry is progressing in your church or fellowship, and the way to evaluate whether you are making progress, is not attendance on Sunday, signed up members, people in small groups, or the size of our budget (as important and valuable as all these things are!). The real test is how successfully you are making disciples who make other disciples. Are we seeing people converted from being dead in their transgressions to being alive in Christ? And once converted, are we seeing them followed-up and established as mature disciples of Jesus? And as they become established, are we training them in knowledge, godliness and skills so that they will in turn make disciples of others?
This is the Great Commission—the making of disciples who obey all that Christ has taught, including the command to make disciples. And this is the touchstone of our faithfulness to Christ’s mission in the world, and the sign of a healthy church: whether or not it is making genuine disciple-making disciples of Jesus Christ.
This has huge implications for how those of us who are ministers of the word think about those in our congregations. What are we doing to enthuse and encourage them to talk to others about the Lord Jesus intentionally? Are we spending our time not only with those who may become full time ministers of the word, but also with those who will stay in the workforce and seek to make disciples of those in their various networks?
I’d make a couple of other comments:
First, if we are serious about seeking to make disciples expect to suffer persecution. The two go together.
Second, when people are seeking to make disciples and their friends/ those in their networks reject the gospel, we need to ensure they know they are not failures. The gospel both saves and condemns, and we mustn’t forget that. And we need to pray with them and for them as, shoulder to shoulder, we continue to seek to make disciples.
Thanks Philip. Perceptive comments as always.
One thing to bear in mind. We naturally think of ‘making disciples’ as referring to evangelism. And that’s certainly where it begins! But in Matt 28 (and in our book), it’s more than that. It’s baptizing people into the name, but it’s also ‘teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you’.
Disciple-making refers to the whole process of prayerfully bringing the gospel to someone, and then sticking with them and establishing them in the faith, and helping them grow to maturity in Christ. It’s like Paul’s little goal statement in Col 1:28: “Him we proclaim, warning everyone and teaching everyone with all wisdom, that we may present everyone mature in Christ”.
So the ‘making of disciples’ includes teaching and encouraging Christians to grow as disciples. It’s all one. And we’re arguing that the goal of ministry is to produce disciples who make other disciples in that sense—who evangelize and teach and encourage in whatever way they can.
TP
Point taken, Tony. I must say I’m looking forward to reading the book you and Col have written.
I wonder if we sometimes minimise the role of those who first bring people to Christ in the ongoing task of discipling them. There’s a lot to consider here.
Hi Tony
Thanks for your post.
Looking forward to reading your book.
A couple of thoughts…
I have always associated ‘making a disciple’ with ‘conversion’ only.
Once converted then a 100% disciple.
Matt 28 seems to indicate:
Make disciples…then teach them.
Connecting the concept of ‘making disciples’ beyond conversion seems to raise issues in relation to assurance of salvation, purpose of salvation, relationships between people (mentoring).
In practice, many using this term move from the emphasis on teaching scripture and put the emphasis on all sorts of other things.
Wondering why the term ‘making a disciple’ was never used (I think) in the epistles?
Di
Tony,
I am not sure if your ten propositions are in order of importance. If they are I must say that in all honesty I am surprised at this. I totally agree with you that one of our goals is to see conversion/gospel growth rather than numerical growth (and far be it for me to even think about writing a book), but if I were to write about the ten propositions about Christian ministry: the first one would be
1. The goal is to honour God and be faithful to Him.
I think the real test of how we are progressing in ministry is how faithfully we are honouring God. One can do this and not see conversion growth for periods of time.
I am also surprised by your suggestion that:
If we measure our ministry by how successfully we are making disciples, I think it can:
1. Can lead to pride (based on how successful we are) – which is wrong because(a)pride is sin &(b)without Christ we can do nothing.
2. Can lead to pragmatism – if people are coming to faith then this means we are successful! It means what we are doing must be working -thus we can slip into thinking it is because of this program, this staff member, this style of service, this youth ministry philosophy that is causing the success. So we may become unwilling and/or unable to question whether what we are doing is Biblical because we are so succcessful we assume it must be, or we don’t care because it is working.
3. Greatly discourage those priests/pastors/ministers/presbyters (take your pick) who are honouring God but in God in His Sovereignty is not bringing the elect to faith for a period of time (months, years, decades).
4.Lead to Arminian thinking that says that we convert people. I think it puts to much onus on us.
Just thoughts from the boofhead.
Great comments, Di and Josh! Very quick responses:
1. Di, in Matt 28 ‘baptizing’ and ‘teaching’ are two participles hanging off the main verb ‘make disciples’. I think they’re explanatory of what’s involved in ‘making’ a disciple of Jesus.
2. You’re right. The disciple-making language (in fact, disciple language full stop) isn’t there in the epistles. But given what the foundational Matt 28 says, we thought it was a handy and legitimate summary of the whole process of seeing someone evangelized, converted, followed-up, taught and growing as a mature Christian. (We do explore the other language and the epistles in the book; this is just a summary, remember.)
3. Josh, there’s a logic to the order but it’s the logic of the book, not of a complete theology of ministry—I guess you’ll have to wait for all ten to see whether you think the logic makes sense!
4. It’s impossible to argue, of course, with the priority of pursuing God’s glory, and of seeing faithfulness as success. But I’m wary of a selective appeal to God’s sovereignty. That is, we preach the gospel and pray, and we recognize that God alone gives the growth (that’s why we pray!)—the place of both Word and Spirit in ministry is covered at some length in the book. But given that Jesus commissioned us to make disciples, do you think it’s OK that we have ‘making disciples’ as our goal? Or for that matter, given that faithfulness in preaching is the criteria, do you think it’s OK to have as a goal that our people are edified? And so to work hard at our preaching to try to achieve this?
In other words, recognition of God’s sovereignty does not preclude thinking about our action and what it hopes to achieve. To make such a dichotomy would indeed be Arminian!
Perhaps, it would be better re-phrased like this: As we seek to prayerfully and faithfully proclaim the gospel to the glory of God, what we are aiming for? What outcome or goal are we working with God to achieve? We’re arguing that the key outcome aimed for should be (under God!) the making of disciple-making disciples. Making disciples is success, even if we recognize that such success is dependent upon God’s sovereign hand.
Hope this helps!
TP
Thanks Tony, I should have taken more notice of those school grammar lessons!
Tony,
Indeed! I wait with eager anticipation for the book!
Allow me to qualify by saying that I am not a hyper-calvinist. I believe that God sovereign election does not abbrogate human responsibility and culpibility when it comes to believf and repentance, nor our mandate to preach the gospel to all nations.
You asked:
Absolutely! – I would only add that this comes under our primary goal which is to Honour God in not only what we do, but alsohow we do what we do. I think the term ‘successful’ may em>possibly</em>
open the door for doing what works rather than doing what is Biblical for the sake of sucess. I know it sounds weird but theological dissonance is a funny thing – it can creep up on us without us knowing it.
As for the earlier questions pertaining to working hard at our preaching and edifying the body of Christ – YES YES YES!
I agree 100% with you,absolutely.
Your last questions are tops! (I love thinking and engaging with these sorts of questions!!!! Keeps me sharp!)
However I only want to reply by offering two more points of thought:
1. If I was to use the term “successful” – I think it would very hard to measure what success in the ministry in this life actually is. 1 Cor 3 comes to mind, also the Parables of the mustard seed, yeast and weeds (Matt 13:21-43) A lot of what God does in a person’s life is not always easily perceived by us. A lot of it is under the surface and is unseen. Some whom we think have come to faith may not have come to faith, some who have not come to faith, whom we think never will under our ministry may do so later.
2. I find it very discouraging when people respond to the gospel by rejecting it. Yet in light of passages such as Matt. 7:13-14; 2 Cor 2:15-16 – many will reject Christ, possibly even the majority of humanity.
3.With the latter passage, it appears that(in a way that we may not often state or even think about),people’s rejection of the gospel may be a result of one’s faithfulness, so I wonder if successful should even be used under the context of conversions? God is still glorified by people’s rejection of him and will be on the last day, so in that sense are those faithful Christians still sucessful?
Sorry Tony, I am tired, and I think perhaps I am digging myself into a hole here. I do agree with you! Really I do! I think what I am trying to say is that our goal of making disciples is a given in ministry, (in fact I think how can any Christian not see this as goal of life?) but I would place this goal under the primary goal of honouring God.
And as far as being successful is concerned, perhaps it should be measured by our fidelity to God, faithfulness in proclaiming the Gospel, preaching the whole counsel of God and living lives worthy of the calling we have received. And not measured by conversions. (Not that I am in any way shape or form, saying that that should be one of the big goals of ministry.
Thankyou for responding to my post so promptly. I hope my ramblings can stimulate further thought, discussion and most of encouragement to those who read this blog. Thankyou again Tony for raising this great topic!
This boofhead is signing off.
Oidhche bha! (Means Goodnight in the language of Eden!)
Josh, sounds like your issue is more to do with the language of ‘measuring’ and ‘success’ than with the idea of goal. I have a lot of sympathy with what you say. I guess the point we were making was not that it’s so important to measure ‘success’ in ministry, but that the usual things we all almost inevitably look for to see whether our church or ministry is ‘going well’ are often not the most important ones.
TP
Hi Tony,
I like what you’ve written and agree in principle with the priorities you have set. One concern to keep in mind though is that placing discipleship above church membership should not foster a ‘go-it-alone’ approach to ministry. This is something I’ve had to deal with in my ministry here in Osaka. Some, in placing discipling above church membership, have neglected broader church responsibilities to an extend that it has affected the unity and effectiveness of the church as a body. The work of discipleship should foster, not diminish, commitment to the local body of Christ.
Spot on, Andrew! Wait for proposition 4.
TP & all,
I made a big typo: What I should have typed was:
Sorry about that!
TP – the language concerns me a wee bit. The reasons why I think I have already elucidated.
.
Absolutely!
It reminds of something very profound a very godly minister told me.
.
The best of course being the proclamation of the gospel.
Thanks again TP (and everyone else) for taking the time to read my ramblings!
Grace and peace everyone!
Nice title. That’s half the battle won…
Why must we even measure “progress?” We should take note of and measure “faithfulness” instead. Because, according to Tony Payne: Jeremiah, Isaiah, et al had ministries that had zero progress. Ministry is tough. We proclaim Christ, & God changes the heart. Progress is an almost useless thing to measure.
A last thank you for the comments on this first proposition. Very helpful. As you’ll see if (when!) you read the final version in the book, you’ve helped me improve it considerably!
TP